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Should I use a 31G needle to draw and something finer to administer?

Asked 17 Mar 2024Modified 2.2 years agoViewed 21k times
6

This is the third vial from the same lot, so I can compare against two known-good ones.

I have read the obvious sources and they disagree with each other, so I would rather ask people who have actually done this.

I have a working setup and a notebook, and I am prepared to be told that my setup is inadequate if that is the answer.

So: what is the actual procedure, and which steps matter as opposed to being ritual?

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askedorla_sheridan14k2717 Mar 2024

5 Answers

Accepted answer first, then by votes
90

Accepted answer

The distinction that resolves most of these questions is understanding what concentration actually means and why it is not the same as label claim.

The concentration you actually work with is label claim times content fraction divided by actual diluent volume, which is usually not the same as the nominal concentration because content is usually not 100 per cent and you rarely measure the diluent volume to 0.1 mL precision.

Reading a lyophilised cake

AppearanceInterpretationAction
Intact opaque puck, proud of baseCycle ran correctlyProceed
Slumped to one sideShipped before fully dry, or vibrationUsually usable; note it
Glassy translucent filmCollapse above glass transitionTest before use
Melt-back ring at stopperThermal excursion in transitTest before use
No visible cake at allVery low fill, or nothing thereWeigh it; query the supplier

Number of stopper piercings matters less than the gauge doing the piercing. A 30G or 31G needle through a butyl stopper leaves a track that reseals; a 21G or 18G drawing needle punches a core and can drop it into the solution.

The insulin-unit standard U-100 means 100 units per millilitre, so one unit is 0.01 mL — this is the conversion that trips up more people here than any other single piece of arithmetic.

If in doubt, use more diluent and accept the shorter usable window.

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P9
answered · acceptedplate_count_9k95k15815 May 2024
Have you seen anything published on this, or is it inference from the mechanism? – linnea_wahlberg 14 hours ago
Useful. I have added the accept threshold suggestion to my own notes. – nine_point_nine 2 months ago
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78

On the detail: the answer depends on exactly which dose and which vial you are asking about, but the method is always the same.

Air bubbles at these volumes are a measurement problem rather than a safety one. A 2 mm bubble in a 0.3 mL syringe is roughly 4 µL, which at 10 units drawn is a four per cent error.

Room temperature before drawing is worth the ten minutes. Cold solution is more viscous, draws slower, and condensation on a cold barrel makes it harder to read the meniscus.

The Arrhenius relationship for drawing kinetics means that cold solution takes noticeably longer to draw than room-temperature solution.

The caveat is that this assumes the vial contains what the label says, and if the content assay has not been done, the arithmetic is precise about an unknown quantity.

Do the arithmetic twice, ideally with someone else doing it independently.

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LS
answeredlukas_sedlacek17k2726 May 2024
Related: the same reasoning applies to the counter-ion question. – petra_hovland 2 months ago
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38

Concretely, work in the order concentration, then volume, then units, and the arithmetic stops being confusing. Concentration is milligrams per millilitre and comes from the vial contents and the diluent volume. Volume per dose is dose divided by concentration. Units on a U-100 syringe are volume in millilitres multiplied by one hundred.

The rounding error accumulates if you round too many times — rounding concentration to 5.0, rounding the dose volume to 0.1 mL, rounding the unit reading to 10 — and the safest approach is to work the full precision and round only the final answer.

The relevant detail is that dead space quantified: a fixed-needle insulin syringe holds roughly 3 to 5 µL in the hub and needle after the plunger bottoms out. A luer-lock syringe with a detachable needle holds 35 to 100 µL depending on the hub design. At 5 mg/mL that is 15 to 25 µg lost per draw on the insulin syringe and 175 to 500 µg on the luer-lock — which over ten draws is the difference between losing a rounding error and losing half a milligram.

The content assay results from major testing services show that nominal vial claim and measured content differ by one to ten per cent, making content a driver of dose error.

Write the arithmetic on the vial label. It costs nothing and removes the step where you reconstruct it from memory.

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LC
answeredlyoph_cake95k2584 May 2024
8Adding for future readers: the certificate should carry the lot number, not just a batch code. – Dr_Bram_Verhoeven 3 months ago
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31

Two people working through the same arithmetic independently should get the same answer, and if they do not, someone has made a unit error.

Worked example, because the general form is easier to trust once you have seen it once. Take a 10 mg vial and add 2 mL of diluent: the concentration is 10 ÷ 2 = 5 mg/mL. A 0.5 mg dose is 0.5 ÷ 5 = 0.1 mL. On a U-100 syringe, where 1 unit = 0.01 mL, that is 0.1 ÷ 0.01 = 10 units. Change the diluent to 1 mL and the same dose becomes 5 units — same dose, half the resolution.

One qualification: if your arithmetic and someone else's disagree by a factor of ten, one of you has made a unit error, and writing out the units at every step is the diagnostic.

If in doubt, use more diluent and accept the shorter usable window.

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CF
answeredclaudia_ferrante46k3823 Apr 2024
29

This is arithmetic, so let us do the arithmetic rather than argue about it.

Breaking it down further: if a 10 mg vial has 96.5 per cent content, you have 9.65 mg of peptide. Divide that by 2.00 mL and your concentration is 4.825 mg/mL, not 5.00 mg/mL, which is a 3.5 per cent systematic error in every dose calculation.

Published data on syringe dead space quantifies low-dead-space designs as retaining under 2 µL against 35 µL or more for conventional detachable-needle syringes.

Do the arithmetic twice, ideally with someone else doing it independently.

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DR
answeredDr_Priya_Raghunathan94k24812 Apr 2024

Your answer

Ask PeptideStack is a static archive. Posting is closed, but the norms are worth stating: answer the question that was asked, show your working, cite the trial or the certificate, and say plainly where the evidence runs out.

Not medical advice. Research-use-only compounds are not approved for human use.