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How do I tell fatigue from an energy deficit on 800 kcal a day?

Asked 26 Aug 2024Modified 19 months agoViewed 30k times
21

Numbers first: fatigue · 800 kcal.

Before I write this off, I want to check whether it is a known failure mode.

I have the lot number, the certificate and the date, and I am happy to compare them against anything.

What is the differential here, and which test discriminates between the options?

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askedcoldbox941k13826 Aug 2024

5 Answers

Accepted answer first, then by votes
117

Accepted answer

Start with what 800 kcal a day leaves you room for, because at that intake the deficit is a live competing explanation rather than a footnote. Protein is 4 kcal per gram, so 100 g costs 400 kcal — 50 per cent of the entire day's energy — and everything else has to come out of the remaining 400. A day that misses protein at 800 kcal has missed it by a wide margin, and fatigue that tracks those days is a nutrition signal. Then separate the two by timing: a dose effect is periodic and phase-locked to the injection or to an increase, and a deficit effect is monotonic and gets worse the longer the intake stays at 800. Log intake, protein and fatigue on the same daily row for a fortnight and the two patterns separate without any further cleverness. Nothing here is medical advice.

The relevant physiology is that a large deficit reduces both available substrate and spontaneous activity, and the second is often mistaken for the first.

Hypothyroidism, sleep apnoea, depression and anaemia all present as fatigue and all become more likely rather than less in this population, so attribution to the compound should be a diagnosis of exclusion.

Iron deficiency is common, particularly in menstruating women, and low intake plus a reduced red-meat share makes it more likely. Ferritin is the test, and it is an acute-phase reactant so it needs interpreting alongside CRP.

Energy deficits above roughly a thousand kilocalories a day are associated with measurable reductions in resting metabolic rate, spontaneous activity and subjective energy in controlled studies.

Sleep is a variable here too, and no amount of eating fixes sleep debt.

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SL
answered · acceptedsian_llewellyn65k14723 Oct 2024
4Confirming that slowing the titration fixed this rather than any of the other things I tried. – Dr_Colm_Fitzhenry 8 months ago
5Worth adding that the area postrema explanation also predicts why it settles. – second_lot 9 months ago
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53

Start with the actual intake, because a substantially suppressed appetite produces deficits far larger than intended and fatigue is the first symptom.

Dehydration from reduced fluid intake alongside reduced food intake produces headache, lethargy and postural dizziness, and is the cheapest thing on the list to correct.

Put another way, sleep quality often changes during rapid weight loss in both directions, and sleep debt produces fatigue that no amount of dietary adjustment will fix.

The caveat is that fatigue with breathlessness, chest symptoms or sudden onset needs assessment rather than dietary adjustment.

Check fluid and sodium before anything more exotic.

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VR
answeredv_ramaswamy68k5725 Nov 2024
32

Answer first: fatigue in this context is usually an energy-intake problem before it is a drug effect, and the arithmetic is the first place to look.

A deficit beyond about a thousand kilocalories a day reliably produces fatigue, reduced training performance and reduced spontaneous movement. With appetite suppressed, deficits of that size arrive by accident rather than by plan.

Fatigue that appeared abruptly, rather than gradually with the deficit, is a different pattern and points away from intake.

Ferritin as an acute-phase reactant is a recognised limitation and is why it is interpreted alongside an inflammatory marker.

Research-use compounds are not approved for human use.

If it persists at an adequate intake, get bloods rather than more theories.

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SL
answeredsian_llewellyn65k14718 Dec 2024
Thank you — this is the answer I was looking for. – RP_C18 5 months ago
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1

The honest answer is that this is usually fixable by eating more, which is unwelcome advice in this context.

Carbohydrate intake specifically affects training performance and perceived energy at a given total intake, which is why very low carbohydrate approaches feel worse in the gym at matched energy.

Attributing a symptom with a wide differential to the most recent change is a common and expensive error.

Abrupt onset points away from the deficit and towards something else.

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TI
answeredteodora_ilic17k2714 Nov 2024
-3

Mechanically, if it persists at an adequate intake, it needs blood work rather than more speculation.

Three days of honest weighed intake usually settles this. Estimated intake in this situation is systematically wrong and usually wrong in the direction that hides the problem.

Self-reported intake underestimates measured intake by twenty per cent or more in doubly labelled water comparisons.

Weigh three days of intake honestly. That answers this most of the time.

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TI
answeredteodora_ilic17k273 Nov 2024
2Any published figure for how long the constipation persists, given it does not attenuate? – laminar_bench 4 months ago
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Your answer

Ask PeptideStack is a static archive. Posting is closed, but the norms are worth stating: answer the question that was asked, show your working, cite the trial or the certificate, and say plainly where the evidence runs out.

Not medical advice. Research-use-only compounds are not approved for human use.